How To Argue With Someone Who Won’t Listen

  Үзсэн тоо 793,331

Charisma on Command

18 өдрийн өмнө

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It seems to be harder than ever to get through to people logically.
In fact, some of the smartest people have the most sophisticated psychological booby traps when it comes to heated subjects. So in this video, we're going to break down why sometimes people won’t listen to reason even when they’re smart, and what techniques you can use to finally get through to someone who can’t listen to reason.

Our video on Steven Crowder:
mnpost.info/zone/fq2nereqpN2prmk/video
Our video on Trevor Noah
mnpost.info/zone/oc2-qMa1aJuMp34/video

⏰TIMESTAMPS⏰
0:00 - Intro.
2:12 - #1: Being stunned by new information.
3:01 - #2: Inaccurately summarizing the other's perspective.
4:01 - #3: Misreading nefarious intent.
4:41 - #4: Regularly moving goalposts.
5:35 - #5: Yelling or getting angry.
6:12 - #6: Attacking someone's character.
6:34 - #7: Retreating Without Concession
8:05 - 3 Key Mindsets To Change Their Mind
9:05 - The Most Dangerous Cognitive Dissonance

Connect with us further:
Website: www.charismaoncommand.com
Facebook: charismaoncommand
Instagram: @CharismaOnCommand
Or if you want to see our personal stuff:
Instagram: @CharlieHoupert
Instagram: @IamBenAltman

Сэтгэгдлүүд
Dawn2334
Dawn2334 2 минутын өмнө
Cool now I can deal with my liberal family members who think covid is real
PianoGesang
PianoGesang 8 минутын өмнө
Well presented and compellingly true but so hard to apply
Ruhman Khalid
Ruhman Khalid 46 минутын өмнө
ive never used logic i used fl studio
Ryan Eric Fussell
Ryan Eric Fussell 2 цагийн өмнө
I just subscribed because I think this is so cleverly written and executed. Some of the best MNpost video has and I watch a fair bit haha. I'm from Perth Australia. Thank you, you are making a great future for everyone. Love it.
667Gullin
667Gullin 2 цагийн өмнө
I can never crack a good joke when I want to.
Vinny
Vinny 4 цагийн өмнө
If you have to go through all these mental gymnastics to try to have a simple discussion, it’s not worth it in the first place. Either you can talk with someone in good faith or you can’t. Most people don’t want a discussion, they want validation and confirmation and won’t stand for anything else. The sad state of humanity and what will doom us.
Sangfroid
Sangfroid 6 цагийн өмнө
There is an old saying that sums this up nicely if you don't want to do all this people management. Never try to teach a pig to sing it wastes your time and it annoys the pig.
F1rst World NomaD
F1rst World NomaD 6 цагийн өмнө
I get the point but can't really say I agree with the analogy. Smoking is an addiction, not cognitive dissonance. Every smoker *know* smoking is ruining your health, no one denies it and many still *want* to live a healthy life.
mtman2
mtman2 6 цагийн өмнө
Shapiro is a smart kid but has huge deficit yet to overcome which time may improve...!
CinematicKnifeArt
CinematicKnifeArt 7 цагийн өмнө
I don’t see how making a joke and becoming non threatening can or will change the prideful persons decision. I see people remaining blind because they refuse to let go
Patrik Meijer
Patrik Meijer 7 цагийн өмнө
In Sweden we say “well, I know this is a fool’s defense speech, but..” There’s a famous novel by August Strindberg about this topic
Brendan Moran
Brendan Moran 7 цагийн өмнө
If what we want is respectful public discourse governed by reason and reality rather than demagoguery and tribalism then what we need is videos about how to listen with attentivenes and self-evaluate with humility. All this video will accomplish is a wider vernacular for people who already know that they're always right. Ben Shapiro probably knows this deep down somewhere, but he's flying too high on the dopamine rush he gets from "DESTROYING COLLEGE LIBTARDS" - such tragedy and comedy all at once, the sapiens conscience enslaved by the reptile brain, the frontal lobe a prisoner to the cerebellum.
Reg Staples
Reg Staples 8 цагийн өмнө
Excellent video - this is critical for our society right now, that doesn't seem to be able to have meaningful discussions about different perspectives without "being offended."
77dris
77dris 9 цагийн өмнө
In 100% of arguments between two people there are always 2 winners, and 2 losers.
77dris
77dris 10 цагийн өмнө
These "argument" videos have one fatal flaw: nobody wins an argument, ever. It doesn't matter if objectively somebody on the outside sees one side as a "winner", nobody has ever convinced another person they are wrong. Look up a little thing called "Identity Protective Cognition".
Carl Baumeister
Carl Baumeister 11 цагийн өмнө
Excellent!
And L
And L 11 цагийн өмнө
Your first mistake was arguing with someone who won't listen to reasons, LOL. Walk away, time is too precious to waste on them.
D G
D G 11 цагийн өмнө
The default debate tactic for many now seems to be just stand and scream. It's not just that they won't listen, they refuse to even hear.
b
b 12 цагийн өмнө
buuhahahaha - love me all "hot neuroscience" skull-measuring takes used in the video ... Extra Harris bootlicking points trying to present his exchange with Affleck as "just asking questions" chadism
God- La-7 Wins-Verdad-9
God- La-7 Wins-Verdad-9 12 цагийн өмнө
Ala verga or adios
Gabe Wood
Gabe Wood 12 цагийн өмнө
4:00 "Mindreading"
Andrew davis
Andrew davis 13 цагийн өмнө
I just dont interact with other humans, nor do i care what their beliefs are..i just look at everything being what it is and move on, no sense in debating with anyone
westganton
westganton 13 цагийн өмнө
So in other words, and please correct me if I'm wrong because I don't want to misinterpret anything, establishing trust with each other again is the only way to re-open constructive and meaningful conversations. I wonder if there's any relationship between the demand for influence these days and the apparent explosion in cognitive dissonance? Could there be any downsides to trusting corporations who thrive from influence capital to assemble reality for us?
Shirley Tramm
Shirley Tramm 13 цагийн өмнө
The audible link isn't working. 😁
I'm Probably Wrong About Everything
I'm Probably Wrong About Everything 14 цагийн өмнө
Imagine a world where we try to understand the person and not win arguments. Where we listen as much, if not more, than we speak. It's the purpose of my podcast "I'm Probably Wrong About Everything".
Iroquois Plissken
Iroquois Plissken 14 цагийн өмнө
You can use cognitive dissonance to influence people to like you.......for example asking someone for a “small” favor.....because there is no gain in it for the target, no external justification, they must justify the behavior internally to avoid cognitive dissonance, such as saying “Im doing this favor bc I like this person”
Ben Steele
Ben Steele 14 цагийн өмнө
The problem is there is a difference between being right and being perceived as winning a debate. Some people included in this video are more concerned with the latter than the former. And some of them are highly effective in accomplishing this end, at least in creating this perception among their fans and followers. They can be frustrating to deal with.
Jon Wheeler
Jon Wheeler 14 цагийн өмнө
OMG I love the Z Nation clip! Favorite show ever!
matekochkoch
matekochkoch 14 цагийн өмнө
interesting topic but very poor executed video
Sylheti Vibe
Sylheti Vibe 15 цагийн өмнө
Islamophobia only care about money.
Chuck Itall
Chuck Itall 15 цагийн өмнө
I'll sum it up in a nutshell what is being advocated here,,,,lying, conning, and manipulation. this is the new paradigm being pushed by these social controling gate keepers. to create an environment so convoluted and dishonest they that who have honed that craft of deception can profit the most. if no one knew what way is up the establishment guru can insert their pretty lies into the mindless proletariat. so the clever trickery here is to portray (and demoniz) anyone who might see through all this..make them "irrational" for justifying "rational" manipulation. don't use logic use cunning, and here again we have the gaming strategy to undermine people in order to insert the controllers false belifs...this stuff goes back centuries and this is all just anther albeit clever modernized form of cult religion. It's all for the sociopathic abusive personality to gain power to exploit.. as with all con artist the con man saddles up close to the victim as their best friend and convinces them they gave only their best interest at heart or the con is off as soon as the victim starts to realize the con, the con men run a game to try and hide themselves or run leaving you holding the bag.
Nick Schneider
Nick Schneider 16 цагийн өмнө
Good video... but far too many ads. Plus the extra ad inside the video at the end!
Indrid Cold
Indrid Cold 16 цагийн өмнө
There is no reason to argue with anybody at all. One gains nothing by arguing. One gains nothing by winning an argument. One gains nothing by losing an arguement. If someone starts arguing. Simply end the conversation and leave the area. I have not argued with anybody in many, many, years. When anybody says, "What you are saying is..." simply end the conversation and leave. The other person is attempting to twist what you said and argue with you.
Jerrald West
Jerrald West 16 цагийн өмнө
Misrepresenting your opponent's view is called creating a straw man argument.
New Something
New Something 16 цагийн өмнө
Truth is ugly and most people don't want to face it.
John Metzger
John Metzger 18 цагийн өмнө
Ben needs bubble wrap. Bubble wrap all the apples with the bad apples. Bubble wrap.
Pam Petrik
Pam Petrik 18 цагийн өмнө
You cannot win a fight with a skunk!
PSYOP Pandakommando,USAF SOC's 193rd SOF WING
PSYOP Pandakommando,USAF SOC's 193rd SOF WING 18 цагийн өмнө
Feelings don't care about your facts, Ben. That's what you forgot about.
Waqar Jamil
Waqar Jamil 18 цагийн өмнө
Hmmm. Not persuaded...
Maa'Quchii
Maa'Quchii 19 цагийн өмнө
Ironic though... we now have the knowledge that the majority of oldest living ppl are smokers... HEAVY SMOKERS.. and smoked their whole lives... so that’s actually a bad example u used... sorry not sorry.... 🤣
Marissa Bones
Marissa Bones 20 цагийн өмнө
My mother
Cheryll Waldrop
Cheryll Waldrop 20 цагийн өмнө
But what do you do when they keep spouting outright falsehoods as the support for their position? If you are not allowed to say, "That's not what happened. Here's the actual footage," then how can you possibly get to the truth?
Kelland Hutchence
Kelland Hutchence 23 цагийн өмнө
But how do you handle a situation where the other person prefers to resort to insults in response to your use of facts and logic. For example, debating with Green sympathisers, as that's almost always what they do.
Brandoballer47
Brandoballer47 Өдрийн өмнө
Was that guy going into withdrawal from cigarettes?.... or what it truly looks like, heroin/ opiates?? Never heard of or seen anyone withdrawal that serious from smoking
Abstract Module
Abstract Module Өдрийн өмнө
This isn't the kind of video I normally watch, but this was really good. This channel as a whole looks interesting.
Soulsphere001
Soulsphere001 Өдрийн өмнө
People do #6 to me all the time, but that doesn't necessarily mean they're wrong in the overall discussion. I try to steer away from that, by telling them they shouldn't try to be insulting, whenever it gets to that point and get back to the topic. I lot of people seem to appeal to emotion than to fact, too, which gets annoying to me. Appeals to emotion have their place, but generally that's something you need to add it after you provide the facts. Though I suppose if you know someone is only affected by appeal to emotion, maybe it's best to start there, but I think that's a bit underhanded to start with. EDIT: On the other side: I have been guilty of #2 and #3. When that happens, you need to realize the mistake and apologize for it.
Morgan
Morgan Өдрийн өмнө
Just be aware that sometimes, really even most of the time, people are not trying to debate. They're just trying to live their lives and someone comes out and starts attacking them about a complicated subject that the person has no time or inclination to debate. They might give some kind of bs answer simply because the truth is just way too complicated.
The Anti-Hype Monitor
The Anti-Hype Monitor Өдрийн өмнө
>smartest people >shows politicians
Noi Thu
Noi Thu Өдрийн өмнө
Que Dios nos perdone.
obbzerver
obbzerver Өдрийн өмнө
That was a rare step into logical dog doo by Ben Shapiro, I was really surprised he so glaringly failed to grasp what Neil was saying. Well, then of course there's also the whole belief in God thing...
A a r o n S t a l e y
A a r o n S t a l e y Өдрийн өмнө
Interesting video; but I think the CoC might have a bit of cognitive dissonance if they think anyone can win an argument ...there is only different degrees of losing.
Joseph Rhodes
Joseph Rhodes Өдрийн өмнө
The second Jordan Peterson clip is not an example of superiority after someone concedes a point. The College kid was not conceding but rather being dismissive with his “ok”. If you watch the whole exchange he does it multiple times throughout. Peterson get progressively frustrated with his dismissive overly confident attitude. There something to de said about getting frustrated with someone ignorant in their argument but this was not a superiority issue in my opinion.
Carl Bowles
Carl Bowles Өдрийн өмнө
People take themselves too seriously. Every one has thier own story. Quit arguing and let them tell you. They will if you allow that.
Joshua Maynard
Joshua Maynard Өдрийн өмнө
Another fantastic video, love your work team
Bryce Stryker
Bryce Stryker Өдрийн өмнө
4:02 mind reading or misreading?
Mike Orłowski
Mike Orłowski Өдрийн өмнө
How about not constructing the whole convoluted narration, explaining psychology instead?
Terri Caldwell
Terri Caldwell Өдрийн өмнө
I just experienced one of these conversations with a friend! I was looking for something that explains why these types of arguments happen! One of the biggest problems with using logic with a person that argues this way is being "blind-sided"! They went back and forth from past to present, constantly "moving the goal post", then they, , added, exclude, switched and denied information! So, I hit them with the "logic" and "facts" trying to get them to own their words/actions and "down the rabbit hole" we went! I'm thinking, reasoning, facts, empathy, sincerity and patience will "win the day"! When the "smoke" cleared , I'm "reminded" that the person feels vulnerable, defensive, has difficulty expressing themselves and "owning" their words/actions and I can't "force" facts down someone's throat or make people own their "stuff"! You can lead a horse to water........! 💞
Terri Caldwell
Terri Caldwell Өдрийн өмнө
I just experienced one of these conversations with a friend! I was looking for something that explains why these types of arguments happen! One of the biggest problems with using logic with a person that argues this way is being "blind-sided"! They went past then present, constantly "moving the goal post", then they, switch, add, exclude and deny information! So, I hit them with the "logic" and "facts" trying to get them to own their words/actions and "down the rabbit hole" we went! I'm thinking: reasoning, facts, empathy, sincerity and patience will "win the day"! When the "smoke" clears, I'm "reminded" that the person feels vulnerable, defensive, has difficulty expressing themselves and "owning" their words/actions and I can't "force" facts down someone's throat or make people own their "stuff"! You can lead a horse to water........! 💞
John Sceats
John Sceats Өдрийн өмнө
This reminds me of when you backed up Bill Gates as a nice fellow in an old video.
Los Thanos
Los Thanos Өдрийн өмнө
Funny, how the right always has an answer about the left, but the right dont have any answers about themselves😂
dan van der torre
dan van der torre Өдрийн өмнө
wow at 5:14 some funny snake eyes going down here
Grant Landis
Grant Landis Өдрийн өмнө
So you're saying that those other people should be more consistent with their beliefs, even though it's o.k. when I do it. Thanks. I learned a lot.
Joel Davis
Joel Davis Өдрийн өмнө
Nice opinions seems very close 😉
Scott Downey
Scott Downey Өдрийн өмнө
Debates dont change the debaters minds.
Tony Storton
Tony Storton Өдрийн өмнө
Good video
Angry Juice
Angry Juice Өдрийн өмнө
Hoo boy. This is 2020 all over again. I will use this against Karens and feminists.
d w
d w Өдрийн өмнө
Thos video is what i would consider to be common sense, but the irony is that exposes the presenters own cognitive dissonance and self unawareness. Very rich indeed.
Solemn GW2
Solemn GW2 Өдрийн өмнө
Excellent video
Ster
Ster Өдрийн өмнө
Here's how to argue with someone who won't listen: Don't. Walk away.
Daphne Cheng
Daphne Cheng 6 цагийн өмнө
what if that someone is a person in power, with a hand over the nuclear switch, actively running towards destruction, and happens to resembles Cheetos?
Burton Kent
Burton Kent Өдрийн өмнө
Auto captioning is turned off on your video. Can you turn it on for those of us who can't hear well or have english as a second language?
Farawlo Farawla
Farawlo Farawla Өдрийн өмнө
All these people that you used to explain your content have a common denominator : All demonic lucipheriens
bemersonbakebarmen
bemersonbakebarmen Өдрийн өмнө
When I listened to Paterson in Sam Harris's Podcast I could literally see Paterson's Cognitive Disonance when he spoke about Truth and God. Point 4 to be precise Or maybe not? Is redefining and relativizing words the same as moving goalposts?
bemersonbakebarmen
bemersonbakebarmen Өдрийн өмнө
I ask because while I dont agree with Peterson in every opinion he has (im not a fan) his ideas seem like wasted potential. He seems stubborn to evolve his ideas into something more than justifications.
Ogre Under Bridge
Ogre Under Bridge Өдрийн өмнө
Frank Zappa is said to have had an IQ of about 180. He was a heavy smoker. -"Yes..." you might say..."but he died of CANCER ! Huh-huh ", you might say. Ogre say he is quite shure Frank inspite being a rather freaked out kind of guy did not smoke his cigarettes with his rear end. A NASA with ASHTRAYS on every table they had, sent us to the moon. We stopped smoking and havent been to the moon since. We cant even manage to re produce those engines they made for that trip. Nicotine is a well known well working nootropic, but it comes with a price of tar. Tar is not so good. But still, I will say the same as Frank. -" I believe that not all we are told by our scientists and governments are true. I Choose to see Tobacco as my favorite vegetable." My freedom of choice wastly outweighs your PC, ideologically or religous decided "truths". My freedom of choice leads to better ways for tomorrow. My freedom of choice are your freedom of choice. It is a matter of principle, even worth dying for. Many have. We will all die. Dying does not matter. What matters is how you live and what kind of world you by your living leave behind for those who comes after you. Thats what "Standards" are for. Nobody likes a dirty toilet. Do your thing, make notes of your successes and mistakes and make it sparkle !
Sugar&Spice
Sugar&Spice Өдрийн өмнө
Affleck is so annoying. He freaking fail as a father and husband. He can't even get the basics down---- yet he thinks he's a moral authority over the rest of us 🤪
Sean Tracey
Sean Tracey 16 цагийн өмнө
Probs roid rage from Batman combined with trying to posture to look good in Hollywood
JAMES BOND
JAMES BOND Өдрийн өмнө
Actual intellectuals are quite boring. That’s why you’ll never see them much on TV
perry jones
perry jones Өдрийн өмнө
i used to like Ben Affleck...never realized he was so self righteous and a jerk.
Jon Wheeler
Jon Wheeler 14 цагийн өмнө
Matt Damon is way worse. At least when I met him at the All Star game at Fenway Park he was.
aRUnKA
aRUnKA 17 цагийн өмнө
I personally wouldn't judge too soon. He was very passionate about the issue, and didn't bother understanding Sam's position. Dissonance happens to us all, and celebrities are subject to a very high amount of scrutiny.
Daniel Johnson
Daniel Johnson Өдрийн өмнө
I'd say it's more of Stop using Logic that is based off teachings in an introduction to Logic course. You're not a Chemist for taking Chemistry I & II You're not a Mathematician for taking Calculus I & II People need to stop pretending to know what logic truly is based on watered down Philosophy. Shapiro is the best example of this, he sounds great to people who know only just enough about Logic to fall for his lines of "Reasoning". In reality they are laced with Fallacy 10 miles long.
Vrbanvs A. T. Silvanvs
Vrbanvs A. T. Silvanvs Өдрийн өмнө
Hehe. Peterson is a perfect example. After getting his head chewed off by Žižek, where he very nicely conceded and started to agree as an intelligent person should, he then as a critic of socialism and everything connected with it went to cure his drug hiccups in Belgrade the very town he used to despise the town riddled with residual socialism where women act way too independently for his taste :) It would've been even better had he chosen Cuba. In both cases the results are pretty much guaranteed.
Mr. Kay
Mr. Kay Өдрийн өмнө
I have cognitive dissonance watching the video examples of smoking all being vaping, which actually aids many people in stopping smoking
Window4503
Window4503 Өдрийн өмнө
I always seem to get stuck on the summary in arguments. Either the person I’m talking to will refuse to understand my position in the first place and just accuse me of saying or promoting things that I don’t, or they’ll get offended if I try to summarize their position and just give up or start insulting me instead of clarifying what they mean or answering my questions. It’s infuriating.
john jagger
john jagger Өдрийн өмнө
islamophobia is not a real thing. shapiro made the blunder of assuming journos /tv interviewers in the uk behave the same way as they do in the usa- we was ignorant of the devils advocate style, where an interviewer will ask questions / take a stance they dont necessarily agree with / cross examine the interviewee to get them to have to answer tough questions and justify their claims etc.
john jagger
john jagger Өдрийн өмнө
stopping smoking does not lead to painful withdrawals, i think youre talking about junk, mate. stopping smoking is hard because your brain tells you relentlessly that a smoke would be nice and ya want one, its mental and to a degree emotional, but its not physical in terms of any actual pain. ive done both btw.
lafreeway
lafreeway Өдрийн өмнө
Are you really arguing if one of you is not listening? My wife thinks we argue all the time but I never pay attention to what she says, rather, I am thinking about the cute Asian girl at the pool. When she finishes her rant, I head out to the golf course.
Stupid Anon
Stupid Anon Өдрийн өмнө
"Ben Affleck makes a good point that most Muslims are good people." . . . Given the laws in places like Saudia Arabia and Pakistan, majority-Muslims countries, I'm going to have to disagree with you there.
Joe Coolioness
Joe Coolioness Өдрийн өмнө
Most people in most religions are good. Most people in general are good. The problem with religions is it drives irrationality and encourages very harmful acts on innocent people. Not giving a child medicine because it goes against your particular brand of fairy tale is an example.
marie downey
marie downey 2 өдрийн өмнө
cognitive dissonance
raccoon sama
raccoon sama 2 өдрийн өмнө
I'm definitely not the only one who saw most of these in a "curb your" memes
rautermann
rautermann 2 өдрийн өмнө
One of the most valuable lessons on this channel! Thank you
Sophie Oshaughnessy
Sophie Oshaughnessy 2 өдрийн өмнө
Ben Shapiro is as self reflective as a lawn mower.
Omadayus Jones
Omadayus Jones 2 өдрийн өмнө
Fascinating paradigm. Wow. thank you for posting this.
Raw Dollah
Raw Dollah 2 өдрийн өмнө
I dont think these indicators are relevant to cognitive dissonance. You must know the truth before you can be in a state of cognitive dissonance. The rest is just ignorance.
P Raulin
P Raulin 2 өдрийн өмнө
If they won't listen to reason please don't waste your time and energy and emotion on them. They are not worthy of your regard
Banraku M
Banraku M 2 өдрийн өмнө
can i like this twice
Nicki Silvers
Nicki Silvers 2 өдрийн өмнө
I think Ben Shapiro was spot on about Andrew Neil!
LoviNoch
LoviNoch 2 өдрийн өмнө
It seems the writer of this video just recently learned the phrase "cognitive dissonance" and entirely misunderstands its applicability. If you watch this video without your critical brain switched on, you will soon be able to conflate (just like the writer/narrator) inconsistency, stubbornness, childishness, apathy, and a whole host of other generally negative human traits for his precious "cognitive dissonance." COGNITIVE DISSONANCE is not a catch-all for every idiotic thing that gets done. Please do not confuse the world, the masses are uneducated and damn near unable to walk and breathe without some kind of intellectual quagmire. Cognitive Dissonance is when you have competing positions/opinions/beliefs within yourself which are at odds with one another. THAT IS ALL FOLKS. Not this hodge-podge free-for-all that labels every human mental frailty not brought on by age or infirmity as CD.... my god the dumbing down of the world is nearly complete.
K K
K K 2 өдрийн өмнө
I really like that you seem to be unbiased. You pointed out good AND bad things that the same person did. Thank you. 👍🏻
rosesforhanjisung bananamilkforchan
rosesforhanjisung bananamilkforchan 2 өдрийн өмнө
This reminds me of old stereotypes of guides for men on how to talk with women 😂
Shale
Shale 2 өдрийн өмнө
This channel is a gateway to the alt right
Shale
Shale Өдрийн өмнө
@Lopsided once, he's made other videos praising Jordan Peterson, Steven Crowder, ben Shabino etc. This channel doesn't actually have any fact based analysis, it's all just pseudointellectual comments. Trust me, I went down that path and know how this plays out.
Lopsided
Lopsided Өдрийн өмнө
Whatchu mean. He literally criticized Ben Shapiro
Renee McLane
Renee McLane 2 өдрийн өмнө
So what you are saying is.... You are a major J Peterson fan.
J C
J C 2 өдрийн өмнө
If everything was logic and reason based we would never be able to create anything.
jean-louis pech
jean-louis pech Өдрийн өмнө
the most uncreative peoples are not the more logical.
Chris Holifield
Chris Holifield 2 өдрийн өмнө
Ummmmm. Andrew Neal is on the left
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